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[shapps]

Well done to Mighty Hatfield for successfully chairing last night's meeting about the incinerator.  This is my account of the meeting and others may have different recollections.

This residents meeting was held at Hilltop, Hatfield, with the purpose of providing an update and a platform for residents and local representatives to discuss where the incinerator plans are up to and the best way forward.

All the main political parties were represented.

The meeting kicked off with Mighty Hatfield setting the scene, explaining where the proposals were up to and referring to a number of previous meetings and documents.  Essentially, there is a long time scale associated with this project with an incinerator being built somewhere in Hertfordshire in 2015/16. This time table was referred to in passing:

  April 2009 to 2010 - EIA takes place

April 2009 - Waste management companies begin talks with the council

June 2009 – Waste Company bidders discuss outline solutions with the council

September 2009 – Number of bidders is narrowed down to 3 or 4

January to September 2010 – Talks with bidders continue to narrow choice to 2 for final tender stage.

September 2010 – Final tenders invited

March 2011 – Waste management contractor appointed

March 2010 to 2011 – Planning permission process

March 2012 to 2015 – Construction phase

March 2015 – Plant opens.

Next up was Mike Hobday who explained that he has 20 years of experience in fighting incinerators of all types and in different locations. He said believes that the provision of an incinerator leads to less recycling and that the entire approach was defective.

I then spoke and mentioned that I had begun working with residents on this issue back in March 2008 and that they had my full support. I said that I had written to the 6 waste management companies to point out the likely scale of objection to the New Barnfield site and (should have said) that I have invited the Managing Directors of each of the firms for a meeting with me. I am also writing to each member of the Herts CC Waste Management Committee with similar information.

There were then a number of contributions from the floor from nearby residents, expert environmental campaigners.

I will leave this thread open for others (particularly residents who were there) to fill in the detail. The Welwyn Hatfield Times were present and will provide a further write up.

The important thing about the meeting was that it demonstrated a strong degree of cross-party support for the campaign.

Grant.

P.S. If you haven't signed my Save New Barnfield petition yet then please do so here http://www.SaveNewBarnfield.com

[shapps]

Welwyn Hatfield Times report http://www.whtimes.co.uk/content/whtimes/news/story.aspx?brand=WHTOnline&category=News&tBrand=HertsCambsOnline&tCategory=newslatestWHT&itemid=WEED27%20Aug%202009%2008%3A49%3A30%3A690

[MikeHobday]

The important thing about the meeting was that it demonstrated a strong degree of cross-party support for the campaign.

Grant.

Let's be clear - if there was cross-party support to protect New Barnfield, then the 100% Tory County Council cabinet - including Hatfield South Tory County Councillor Stuart Pile - wouldn't have voted for incineration, and wouldn't have voted to clear the library from the New Barnfield site.

There's certainly not cross-party support against incineration. While I have opposed incineration for twenty years, and opposed incineration when I was a WGC County Councillor, Grant is quoted in today's Welwyn Hatfield Review saying that "energy from waste might be a good idea." Indeed, he's found a site for the incinerator:

A) exactly where within your own constituency do you think these suitable alternatives for a waste incinerator are?

The best location would be somewhere where there are no residents nearby and where there are excellent road or rail transport links.  I would have thought that Junction 3 of the A1M which is directly on the motorway and without nearby residents would be appropriate. There is unused land to the West of the Junction.

Still, everyone deserves a third chance . Let me repeat the offer:

Grant, I'm presenting the Action Hatfield petition against the incinerator to the County County waste panel at 2 pm on Wednesday 9 September. Want to come along?
Everyone else welcome of course.
Mike

 

[shapps]

Still, everyone deserves a third chance . Let me repeat the offer:

Grant, I'm presenting the Action Hatfield petition against the incinerator to the County County waste panel at 2 pm on Wednesday 9 September. Want to come along?
Everyone else welcome of course.
Mike

Hi Mike, several people approached me to comment that you were the only person to go political with this issue at the meeting the other night and I think I spotted that you'd also put Labour logos on your petition too (though stand to be corrected on this).  I understand that only one person can present and speak at the meeting and I'm sure you'll do a good job.  Incidentally, I had previously asked on this thread (twice) how many signatures you're presenting. Third time lucky perhaps?

Our petition now has 540 online signatures and we don't yet know the number of offline signatures, but it is growing.  We'll present this at a later stage to both County and to the waste companies who I have invited to come and meet me in order that I can explain the depth of concern.

Good luck.
Grant.

[MikeHobday]

Still, everyone deserves a third chance . Let me repeat the offer:

Grant, I'm presenting the Action Hatfield petition against the incinerator to the County County waste panel at 2 pm on Wednesday 9 September. Want to come along?
Everyone else welcome of course.
Mike

Hi Mike, several people approached me to comment that you were the only person to go political with this issue at the meeting the other night and I think I spotted that you'd also put Labour logos on your petition too (though stand to be corrected on this).  I understand that only one person can present and speak at the meeting and I'm sure you'll do a good job.  Incidentally, I had previously asked on this thread (twice) how many signatures you're presenting. Third time lucky perhaps?

There's no Labour logo on the Action Hatfield petition. I haven't counted numbers yet, but will be sure to do so before presenting the petition.

And yes, I'll continue to make political comments where appropriate - for as long as the 100% Tory County Council cabinet continues to dump on Welwyn Hatfield. And for as long as the Welwyn Hatfield Conservative Association continues to promote and support the cabinet members who treat local residents so badly.
 
If you can blame Labour for decisions made by the non political Primary Care Trust, I'll blame the Tories for decisions made by the very political county council cabinet!
 
Regards
 
Mike

[mythoughts]

Without conducting any research itself into the the possible health hazards presented to those living near waste incinertors, the Health Protection Agency has seen fit to deem them safe.
 
Actually, the HPA has always deemed them to be safe but, in my view, has now embarked upon a PR campaign to smooth the way for the implementation of WI and has simply re-released its long-held position on this to facilitate that.
 
Now, we all know there's good and there's bad science BUT the HPA has revealed that it does not even recommend undertaking any scientific research exploring the possible health risks posed by waste incinerators.
 
In my opinion, making decisions on public health without conducting scientific research is nigh on negligent. And this is the lot that's supposed to help us get through Swine Flu 2 - The Terminator.
 
Prediction: In ten years time the HPA will commission research to find out why there are higher incidences of birth deformities and specific cancers found amongst populations living within a certain proximity of waste incinerators.
 

 
http://www.edie.net/news/news_story.asp?id=16940&channel=0&title=Incinerators+'no+significant+threat'+to+public+health
 
 Full report:

 http://www.hpa.org.uk/web/HPAwebFile/HPAweb_C/1251473372218
 

[MikeHobday]

Thanks to all local residents who came with me to the County Council's waste panel this afternoon to support the presentation of our anti-incinerator petition. I've summarised my comments to the waste panel on my blog at http://mikehobday.blogspot.com/
Mike

[rick]

Two points:

1.  If an incinerator is to be built, it should be strategically located so that BOTH THE ELECTRICITY AND THE HEAT can be used by high energy demand consumers nearby.  This way, the pollution caused by burning unavoidable and non-putrescible waste streams will at least come hand-in-hand with the maximum sustainability gain - at least in terms of reducing CO2 emissions from burning precious fossil fuels at conventional 'electricity only' plants. 

This will be possible to a greater or lesser degree at each of the proposed sites as the infrastructure cost of piping hot water long distances can quickly become prohibitive.  Is this investment in DECENTRALISED LOW-CARBON HEAT AND POWER being considered in conjunction with the wider energy and carbon reduction strategy of the local development plans?

2.  Your squabbles over your respective petitions are symptomatic of the reasons why so many of the electorate choose not to support either of you. 

[mythoughts]

Biffa waste incinerator planned for Ware:
 
http://www.letsrecycle.com/do/ecco.py/view_item?listid=37&listcatid=217&listitemid=53526&section=waste_management
 

 "Our proposal is not directed at the Hertfordshire domestic refuse contract for which other organisations are currently tendering. Our plans are to deal with the non-hazardous waste produced by the thousands of businesses, shops and organisations in the area,"
 
Full press release:
 
http://www.biffa.co.uk/news/Plans_for_Hertfordshire_energy_recovery_facility
 

[mythoughts]

Some recent headlines with links to full stories re WI:
 
Pro-incineration expert denied risks of second-hand smoke:
http://www.vancouversun.com/health/incineration+expert+denied+risks+second+hand+smoke/2066149/story.html
 
Incinerator row hots up after protest
http://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/Article.aspx/1428910?UserKey=
 
UK rubbish levels 'waste millions'
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/ALeqM5ht1P1FGWMoGhcOg0xVFgO-Xc9rLw
 
UK losing £650m a year by binning and burning waste
http://www.theecologist.org/News/news_round_up/333537/uk_losing_650m_a_year_by_binning_and_burning_waste.html
 
Wildlife fears over incinerator plans
http://www.chad.co.uk/news/Wildlife-fears-over-incinerator-plans.5708437.jp
  Incinerator protestors take to streets Hundreds of Peterhead residents protested against a proposed waste to energy plant on the outskirts of the town http://news.stv.tv/scotland/north/128343-incinerator-protestors-take-to-streets/

[shapps]

Thought it might be useful in the context of our discussion on New Barnfield to post this newsletter from Herts CC up on the Welwyn Hatfield Forum.

At the end of the newsletter I've suggested a course of action that you might like to take:




Residents should take part in the consultation about the waste development framework by writing in and asking for New Barnfield to be removed from the Sites List.  It will all help add to the pressure.

Grant.

[rogbert]

The problem is if it dosent get built in hatfield it has to go somewhere else in hertfordshire, in someones else back yard who would be in our situation so what do we do . we need somewhere to dispose of our rubbish if you look at sweden they have been running waste disposal sites for years in town centres getting power to run public resources.

[John Wood]

Berkshire are hoping to have their waste treatment plant, at Stewartby in Bedfordshire.

[BenedictMcAleenan]

Hi Everyone,

The County Council is now embarking on two consultations.

The first is on the Waste Core Strategy and Development Policies and the second is on Waste Site Allocations.  The start date is tomorrow (Nov 2nd) and the closing date is Dec 18th.

The consultation is available at: http://consult.hertscc.gov.uk/portal/minerals_and_waste/cs/wcs

People can also respond in a number of other ways as outlined at www.hertsdirect.org/wasteplanningconsultation . Paper, electronic or by visiting the HCC or district council offices are other ways to respond, in case you know people who can't access the consultation online.

Although the consultations are not part of the Waste Procurement process, they can be useful to register resident opposition to New Barnfield being on the waste sites list in the first place.

Although we also have petitions running and are generally trying to make a big noise about these things, the consultation is a more 'official' way to protest the use of New Barnfield.

So, please make sure you go to http://consult.hertscc.gov.uk/portal/minerals_and_waste/cs/wcs
and make your point against New Barnfield being used for any waste processing facility (aka incinerator).

Thanks,

Benedict.

[mythoughts]

Without conducting any research itself into the the possible health hazards presented to those living near waste incinertors, the Health Protection Agency has seen fit to deem them safe.
 
Actually, the HPA has always deemed them to be safe but, in my view, has now embarked upon a PR campaign to smooth the way for the implementation of WI and has simply re-released its long-held position on this to facilitate that.
 
Now, we all know there's good and there's bad science BUT the HPA has revealed that it does not even recommend undertaking any scientific research exploring the possible health risks posed by waste incinerators.
 
In my opinion, making decisions on public health without conducting scientific research is nigh on negligent. And this is the lot that's supposed to help us get through Swine Flu 2 - The Terminator.
 
Prediction: In ten years time the HPA will commission research to find out why there are higher incidences of birth deformities and specific cancers found amongst populations living within a certain proximity of waste incinerators.
 

 
http://www.edie.net/news/news_story.asp?id=16940&channel=0&title=Incinerators+'no+significant+threat'+to+public+health[/]
 
 Full report:

 http://www.hpa.org.uk/web/HPAwebFile/HPAweb_C/1251473372218[/]
 

Just out today, in Scotland, the line is more cautious than the HPA:
 
SEPA report on health effects of incinerators is inconclusive 02 Nov 2009

http://www.mrw.co.uk/page.cfm/action=Archive/ArchiveID=26/EntryID=5992

http://www.documents.hps.scot.nhs.uk/environmental/incineration-and-health/incineration-of-waste-and-reported-human-health-effects.pdf